The one you sent worked well, but I didn't see it before I sent mine.

Yes, it is indeed a beautiful song.

Thanks for your input.

Stronger (What Doesn't Kill You)Kelly Clarkson

http://music.163.com/#/mv?id=31531

Sorry hadn't realised you got a link in for that song before me-makes mine surplus to requirements.

Yes, it is indeed a beautiful song.

Thanks for your input.

Stronger (What Doesn't Kill You)Kelly Clarkson

http://music.163.com/#/mv?id=31531

Whch song is that?

Oh, sorry to hear that. Glad you survived it all.

Immersion in a foreign country. I am a mono-lingual U.S. citizen who has spent 12 years in China.

I think you are being self-deprecating, Trumpsey and your Chinese is quite good?

What's the 'US.Citizen' bit about. I am a little suspicious about that constant emphasis because your English would normally be considered to be a bit too handy to be American. You're not British masquerading as one of them ,are you? But you can tell me to mind my own business if you like. Australian or Canadian?

You read my post too fast, SB. You missed the funny part of it

"Immersion in a foreign country (or immersion in horny foreign men in a topless bar)
provides ample and unavoidable opportunities to learn an oral 2nd language. My poorly
spoken Chinese has been acquired in that manner. "

Pray tell ASAP which one of the two "Immersion in a foreign country" or
"immersion in horny foreign men in a topless bar"

Immersion in a foreign country. I am a mono-lingual U.S. citizen who has spent 12 years in China.

"Immersion in a foreign country (or immersion in horny foreign men in a topless bar) provides ample and unavoidable opportunities to learn an oral 2nd language. My poorly spoken Chinese has been acquired in that manner. "

Pray tell ASAP which one of the two "Immersion in a foreign country" or "immersion in horny foreign men in a topless bar"

I suppose we could say that foreign language learning is a scam. If learning foreign language is so difficult then why can even uneducated Pattaya bar girls learn English quickly without taking any classes? Same with Chinese. You don't need a Chinese teacher or classes to learn it. The Chinese tried to con foreigners that their language is hard to learn, but we are awake to them now.

Only have to go back to the pioneering days of the British Army. No powerpoints or lesson plans in those days but ordinary British soldiers managed to master all the world's languages to communicate with the natives. There's a lot in what you say SB. Which is why all China needs is retired postmen and the like.

I did have something to do with a TC which mainly employed Eastern Europeans. They crossed out most of the correct English in the text books and replaced it for really bad English.Even to the extent of altering,,,say 'Southend-on-Sea' they would cross out reasoning that a town can't be built on the sea and it should more accurately be described as 'Southend near the sea' hahaha. So the text books were difficult indeed to read through the biro alterations of changing good English into bad because foreigners know better.

The Chinese will do this to some extent. Before they copy a 'Cambridge' textbook they will alter a lot of the English written in England. But the Eastern Europeans are even worse and a training centre would do better with a retired toilet cleaner from Southend.

I suppose we could say that foreign language learning is a scam. If learning foreign language is so difficult then why can even uneducated Pattaya bar girls learn English quickly without taking any classes? Same with Chinese. You don't need a Chinese teacher or classes to learn it. The Chinese tried to con foreigners that their language is hard to learn, but we are awake to them now.

I should add to that post that I have always been consistent in saying that well-read degreeless native English speakers often make better FT's than the degree-holding variety, for the simple reason that they realise that they haven't got scraps of paper which say they are educated so they make an effort to be good in grammar, writing, reading and writing lesson plans.

On the other hand, second language teachers of English should stay in their own countries and teach, ideally as teaching assistants to natural English speakers.

Of course Native English degree-holding teachers should commandb higher remuneration than the degreeless native. I certainly don't propose that some sweaty ex-lumberjack should get as much dosh as say...our Trumpsey. Now, Am I right or am I right?

Most schools hire "FTs" (Foreign Teachers) rather than English Teachers, so any foreigner who speeeks some English should be just fine. Then, most schools' management expect those "FTs" to practice with students what they have already learnt, so little is needed to fulfill the duty.

Whom I condemn are the ones that purposely manipulate people, situations and the media. The Falklands, Gibralter or Diego Garcia have had their locals, forums true users before, and the Chinese classrooms have had FTs that gave students a lot more before than they do today too. Perhaps, the ironic connection in between colonizing the lands and/or protecting them is here on the topic where Chinese want to protect their land/culture and local jobs even if all those come at an expense which in this case may be the poor quality of education. Perhaps, had we not colonized around the globe to such an extent as we've had, we would have had a better recognition than we have in international classrooms today.

Where are you from then, caring? I am confused because the spelling is USA - lots of Zedds. You can't be Canadian since the Canadians use British Spelling- unless thery go out of their way to copy Americans....but why on earth would anybody want to do that? I am using your least sentence which suggests you are British?

Most schools hire "FTs" (Foreign Teachers) rather than English Teachers, so any foreigner who speeeks some English should be just fine. Then, most schools' management expect those "FTs" to practice with students what they have already learnt, so little is needed to fulfill the duty.

Whom I condemn are the ones that purposely manipulate people, situations and the media. The Falklands, Gibralter or Diego Garcia have had their locals, forums true users before, and the Chinese classrooms have had FTs that gave students a lot more before than they do today too. Perhaps, the ironic connection in between colonizing the lands and/or protecting them is here on the topic where Chinese want to protect their land/culture and local jobs even if all those come at an expense which in this case may be the poor quality of education. Perhaps, had we not colonized around the globe to such an extent as we've had, we would have had a better recognition than we have in international classrooms today.

Good to see you back in action, Caring.

You can hardly blame the people of the Falklands and Gibralter for not wanting a load of Latins or Diagoes to take over, now can you? They is alright sitting in the the sun with cigars muttering about greengoes and plotting ways of getting into USA. hahaha only joking. I hate these stereotypes actually.

You're so full of it. The role of a FT is questionable and so is the qualification. Anyhow, you may keep at it here just like the folks in Falklands have it erected for their queen.

The nationality of a teacher should be important because only Native English Speakers should teach English(as an FT;) therefore, a Russian or German should be rejected in the same way as an African should be rejected. No special exceptions should be made because of the colour of your skin, black or white. Clearly they shouldn't have laughed at the hapless African before they rejected him. You say "The have been caught laughing at an African man" Who was it that caught them?? They should have politely told him that their policy was only to employ teachers from -Canada, UK, USA, Australia, New Zealand, Ireland, Falkland Islands, Jersey and maybe other British dependencies who only speak English.

However, in the past there have been some Russians, Germans and Eastern Europeans with very
strong accents, even some of them having being academics, who have been let go quickly
on account of complaints from their students

"have been" "even some" "having being" "have been" "quickly" "on account of"

This is text book Chinese academic writing: needlessly complex sentence structure where verb agreement collapses, littered with archaic prepositional phrases.

My point exactly: Because there are so many accents in the UK, in order to understand most people you happen to meet in one day (in the tube, having a pint at the pub, shopping, talking to the server at the restaurant, etc.), it's OK if your ESL teacher had a strong accent (Russian or other) because at least you will understand that type of accent.

I vividly remember the first time I went to London: the nice receptionist (at an OK hotel) told me something like aiiielloooo. I made her repeat twice. It was embarrassing for both of us because it was the very first word that she told me. She was simply trying to say Hello. My tolerance to various accents was more important in that setting than having studied with a native English teacher. It's in the mind. Not in the way you position your tongue behind or between your teeth.

In fact you are right, both our points are nigh indistinguishable from one another. Great minds think alike, Fifi. I'll pop mine from that post underneath, so all other posters can wonder at how two posters can be so alike. got to be marriage material. haha!

Some of us do speak with strong English accents(not me) but we are fully understanding of the language as only a natural-born-speaker can be- whereas Ivan has a strong accent but no saving graces. Most native-speakers with strong accents manage to tone it down for the classroom. In UK we have a richness of accents and foreigners should like it or lump it.

However, in the past there have been some Russians, Germans and Eastern Europeans with very strong accents, even some of them having being academics, who have been let go quickly on account of complaints from their students.

The Chinese do not like strong English accents!

Some of us do speak with strong English accents(not me) but we are fully understanding of the language as only a natural-born-speaker can be- whereas Ivan has a strong accent but no saving graces. Most native-speakers with strong accents manage to tone it down for the classroom. In UK we have a richness of accents and foreigners should like it or lump it.

When I read the reviews on here I am thankful I am not one of those people who depends on teaching ESL in China for survival.

It is really sad, pathetic almost, that for some people teaching ESL is their only choice in life.

As for native speakers, only employing teachers from Australia, UK, USA and Canada IS racist.

This is blatant discrimination that Chinese disgracefully get away with in all walks of life. There are plenty of people from Africa, Philippines, etc who can teach English.

I'm afraid that things have changed since you were here- the Chinese now love employing Russians, Swedes, anybody but native English speakers and Africans. Well I exaggerate a bit, the employment of Eastern Europeans and continental Europeans is becoming the norm. Most African cannot be understood very well when they speak English and they should never have been employed. This is not a colour issue at all. Not even a racist issue for the Chinese- Russians and Africans come cheaper. It's business.

I am writing this message as a warning to anyone who is considering a job at a school called "Star Splendor" in the north eastern city of Jinzhou, in Liaoning province China. They are openly racist and have made it abundantly clear that they would never hire a person with dark skin. The have been caught laughing at an African man who walked into the school looking for work. This is not uncommon for private schools, only hiring white people (no matter what nationality) instead of actual qualified applicants.

The nationality of a teacher should be important because only Native English Speakers should teach English(as an FT;) therefore, a Russian or German should be rejected in the same way as an African should be rejected. No special exceptions should be made because of the colour of your skin, black or white. Clearly they shouldn't have laughed at the hapless African before they rejected him. You say "The have been caught laughing at an African man" Who was it that caught them?? They should have politely told him that their policy was only to employ teachers from -Canada, UK, USA, Australia, New Zealand, Ireland, Falkland Islands, Jersey and maybe other British dependencies who only speak English.